Here in Greater Phoenix, we  can tell our story differently, a new  perspective, a different look, Greater Phoenix A to Z. 

Good morning, afternoon, or evening, depending on when this finds you. Welcome to the Greater Phoenix A to Z podcast. I am your host today, Tim Bourcet. Casey Gilchrist is not here. She will be coming back next week. So I'm here without my partner in crime, but we have a very, very fun podcast today. It is going to be a great one.

One that is very close to my heart as an Arizona native, and a music junkie and we are recording here live in the city of Mesa at the historic Nile theater and its owner, Michelle Donovan, Michelle, thank you so much for joining the podcast today. 

Thanks for coming down to the Nile. 

I said, I was excited.

I've spent many, many a night here over the last about 20, 25 years. And you provide a valuable service to the region. And so we are very excited for this, but for all of our listeners, Michelle, you're the owner of the Nile theater and coffee shop. Please tell our audience a little bit about yourself and your journey to this position.

Yeah. So I've been here 15 years now. We reopened at the end of 2009. Initially it was just the basement, then the main room reopened. And then we were subletting the front room to another coffee shop. We took over that space in 2015. Opened it as a vegetarian coffee shop, transitioned to all vegan.

We just recently opened Nile Records, which is across the street. And we have a small record store that features a lot of the bands that have come through here coming through in the future So we do everything from like shows to wrestling to we've had some weddings We do commercial shoots white castle was just in here doing a commercial Or kind of just like a big community space that covers everything adjacent to music.

And obviously here in the heart of downtown Mesa, some really great development and, and, and community, you know, involvement looking around. Obviously it looked quite, quite a bit different 20 years ago than it is today. So it's really fantastic to see all of your businesses thriving. Obviously the topic for today is really music in the region.

We're going to be talking to some folks later on about some other venues, but this is hugely important and we're about to get into that now.  Many Arizonans know about the Nile, but just in case, you know, a very rich history established in 1924 through present, could you give us a brief overview of the iterations of the Nile over the last 100 years?

Yeah. So it started off as a, you know, a playhouse and a movie house. And then it's been everything from a dress factory to a church, to a music venue again, to a church again. It's,  Roots are in entertainment. It was one of the first air cooled theaters in the entire state  And it's had it was kind of a domino effect in the region.

The building cost two hundred thousand dollars to build back in the 20s And that's kind of set the standard for a lot of other theaters that were opening across Phoenix and all of arizona the orpheum same builders. So it's had its ups and downs. It's been notorious for being a music venue in the late 90s, early 2000s.

And then when we reopened it, we really worked hard to establish a mutual respect with the community. And I feel like we're there now. We just were designated a historic landmark last year. We redid the facade in, I want to say 2018. So now it's kind of like a beacon of like the history of downtown.

Cause a lot of them are covered up with stucco. So we have, we feel that we play a very important role in the culture. Of mesa and the building has for the last hundred years 

Absolutely, you brought up a good point about it being one of the first air cooled buildings in one of the articles I read I think most people think of an actual unit an air conditioning unit, but I believe in the article I discussed how it was actually almost like a shed With ice and fans and it was it was kind of a an early swamp cooler if you will is that give or take?

Dry ice down in the basement. There was a tunnel That would connect the two basements and then back upstairs. So I'd have giant fans blowing on the ice and it would circulate throughout the building. 

Incredible to think about over, well, not over a hundred years, but almost a hundred years ago.  Now you just mentioned something and, you know, I wanted to bring that back up.

It's rich history. Arizona is a new state. So anything that is a hundred years old is Pretty that's, that's, that's significant. And so you talked about the historic landmark designation. Could you maybe tell our, our listeners how that process went? What, what did you go through in order to attain that?

It's kind of been a process because when we first took over the building, it was covered in stucco and it had one of those heavy colonnades that was put on, I believe in the eighties, the city wanted it to be a more walkable space. So they put on these colonies to provide shade for, for the Pedestrians down here.

So we applied for the facade improvement grant. We Received it. It was about a year and a half two years of construction ripped off all the stucco Exposed the original brick and we tried to harken it back to the 1920s as close as we could get so from there We just kind of sat on it for a little bit and then we started the historic.

Landmark process before the pandemic then the pandemic came You Stopped all progress whatsoever. And then last year I reapplied. You have to get approval from the neighbors. You have to,  there's certain like benchmarks you have to make with the Historic Preservation Society. City council then votes on it and then ultimately we were granted the local designation.

That's great. And you said that provided for a grant of sorts. That was, we did not get a grant. The 

grant was for the facade improvement. Gotcha. So now our next steps are we turn a hundred in September, the building does and we want to get a replica of the original marquee that was on the building. So we're going to take this, continue to try to restore the outside as close as we can to the 1924.

Iteration of the building and then apply for a national registry. 

That's great. And now, again, you, as you said, this is really known as a music venue, but as you hit at the top that you have all kinds of events, I believe you said wrestling, I'm a big pro wrestling fan. So that's music to my ears. You said weddings, commercials, any other type of events.

I know that you guys will bring in artists, things like that, but just what other type of events? Anything fun? Like 

a finger skateboard event. Which I remember when I was little, I did not understand that there was a whole subculture that still existed and it packs out and they have these really ornate parks.

They call them, they bring them in and they're beautiful and you just have like hundreds of kids fingerboarding for hours on like a Sunday morning. That's like one of my favorite ones cause there's a lot that is adjacent to what we do where the people that come here have these other Hobbies or whatnot.

We do a record fair once a year, at least once a year. We started that way back and we'll have up to like 26, 30 record vendors, local collectors, stores, whatnot. And that brings out a good chunk of the community to like thumb through vinyl all morning. We do vegan pop ups. During the pandemic, we did the vegan drive through, so everybody was shuttered.

So we put together a website where you could order Food from all these different vegan restaurants and small businesses. We pack it all up in one bag and you would just drive up and somebody would run it out to your car. So we do a little bit of everything. 

That's great. And that's a good transition.

Cause you've mentioned the coffee shop. We were currently upstairs above the coffee shop. But we always like to promote local you know, businesses and everybody loves a good coffee shop. Could you maybe go in a little bit more on the coffee shop? You said all vegan, started vegetarian now all vegan.

Yeah, it's 

a hundred percent vegan. Everything in there. We have Breakfast and some lunch items full coffee bar. It's open seven days a week we do shows in there as well We build out a stage to have full sounding lights in there as well So once we're done with coffee bands roll in it's completely different environment.

We did amigo the devil in there one time donovan malero's played in there Yeah So, it's another multi purpose space and we just got a vintage photo booth put in. So you can get a black and white, like photo booth type of picture of you and your friends before a show, it says an aisle on it. 

Very cool.

So you can come in, you can get some vegan food, take the picture and then go to a show. 

Yeah. 

All one stop shop. 

Yes. 

Okay. Now we were talking before this, we both obviously have been probably to a lot of the same concerts, it sounds like but been here numerous times. Just a fun, personal one. What are some of your.

Personal favorite shows that you have booked here or attended just, just over the years, anything that really, really sticks out. 

So when I was a kid, I would come here because I'm not as old as this building. So there was a period of time where I was not in charge of this place. And some of my favorite shows would be like saves the day played upstairs.

There's like nobody here. I still have that shirt. There's like a million holes in it. Or it seemed like the Atari's and you found glory, like the house band for a while. And they'd be in the basement. And it'd be like way over packed, if you will, but you would just leave here soaked and it was the best.

It was different back then. Like, it was like a badge of honor to me. Oh yeah. bruised and sweaty. 

I'd have to say my favorite, very similar. My favorite show would be, I think it was like July or August in 2002 under oath Zayo and a little band called Unearth who is fairly new coming through and being down in that basement for four hours, completely drenched by the time we walked out.

And it was  top five show I've ever seen. I mean, it was just, it was incredible. 

That's something that I don't know. I think it's lost on some people. We provide A very tangible experience, right? We don't have a barricade unless the band wants it. The basement is a basement in a hundred year old building.

So set your expectations to that. But you're not going to get that anywhere else where it's like you were feet away from the band. The band's walking through the same space as you. 

Well, and it's generational at this point because I was here a few months ago. One years after to see Zayo again in the basement.

And it was just funny to think that that's a, it's, it's literally generational that some folks come here and, and go to the shows. But yeah, just an incredible, and I feel like this has always really been a good venue, especially 20 years ago for some of the more all time. Genres and this has always been kind of a metal hardcore punk emo You've you've really provided that and most of those bands are coming through.

This is where they're going 

yeah, and it's neat to see them still coming through a lot of them are doing like 20 year anniversaries and like get up kids were here last year a year before and I Love the get up kids and it's like holy crap. Now I get to to book them and see them in this space and Yeah, I don't know It's neat and then you have people that come by and they go I used to come here when I was young now I'm dropping my kids off and there's not a lot of venues that have the longevity Yes, there was like that period of time where it was closed down But I mean we're going on 15 years now and fingers crossed.

We're here another 15 years. We leased the building, but we do all like the facade and the historic landmark designation. That's all You and so I think it's really important for people to know about us doing that because we understand and appreciate the history of this place and want to protect it for whoever comes after us.

Absolutely. And it was interesting over the last few days when I've been talking to GPEC staff and people in the GPEC network and there's, Oh, and you know, what's the next podcast I said, we'll be out at the Nile and a lot of our people are East Valley folks, Mesa folks. And so it was interesting. I'm, I'm 39 and I was.

Speaking to a lot of folks that were my age range and every single one of them. I was at that show at this year. I saw this band, you know, five times there I saw. And so it's, it's music brings people joy, especially shows. And so it's always cool to see that tie in and especially with your focus on the community.

And on engaging with that community. I think it's incredible what you guys are doing now. You talked about the next 15 years and just kind of a last question here for you. Any major plans or thoughts in 2024 moving forward, you guys have been very busy, you've been doing a lot, but anything in the near future that you're looking forward to for these establishments?

Yeah. So we opened up the record store in October and we're already going to upgrade it to a larger space. Same But across the hallway, we're moving in there in May. So it'll be larger and we're going to do more like meet and greets and stuff over there. We took over the Mesa farmer's market.

So now the Nile owns and operates a Sunday farmer's market with a bunch of local vendors right across the street from here. So we just want to continue our. You know our footprint in the community and make sure that Mesa has all of these things because for whatever reason It's always been deemed sleepy and we're always a little bit behind and you have all the downtown phoenix vendors Venues and we're just kind of an outlier right and people think of Mesa being so far, but it's come such a long way we have a bunch of breweries and really great restaurants award winning restaurants now like a spare two and Worth takeaway and republica empanada and  So we want to make sure that we provide the infrastructure to have these shows still here because shows bring A ton of foot traffic to downtown mesa and put a ton of money into the economy and other businesses so Our focus is like continuing to bring better shows  We are going to celebrate our 100 year birthday.

Like I said, we're going to try to do the marquee We have a fest that we do in september We're going to try to do a couple other like bigger concert type of Events just to draw attention to the fact that it's big Then a hundred years 

and folks can take the light rail down here in Tempe, Phoenix, anywhere you want to jump on the light rail, come on down, have a beer, have a, have a meal and see a show.

It seems like it's pretty easy, pretty easy path. 

We're right between two stops. You have no excuses. So 

I fully, fully support that. So for listeners who want to support this fantastic venue, please check out the Nile theater. com for upcoming events and shows. We will be sharing links to all of the businesses that Michelle mentioned.

You've got a great coffee shop downstairs, record store, farmer's markets. We will post all those. And most importantly, Michelle, we greatly appreciate you making the time for us today and providing such an intriguing local story for the incredible, incredible music scene in the Valley, again, You just from one music junkie to another.

I appreciate you and everything you've done. And we just thank you very much for your time today. 

Thanks for coming.  

Okay. I am very excited to be back for part two of the Greater Phoenix a to Z podcast focused on the incredible music scene here within Greater Phoenix and my second guest, a Jack of all trades, promoter owner, music aficionado, Charlie Levy, Charlie, thank you for joining us today, sir. 

Hello, Tim. Thank you for having me on this. Big time, huge podcast that you host.  Are you like the Larry King of the 2010s basically? 

I try to be of the Greater Phoenix economic council and economic development organizations. But what we're going to jump right into this, Charlie, when we talked about internally about a music podcast, I said, I'm going to hope and pray that we can get him to talk about a few minutes because you have had a hand in Many, many venues and concerts and all kinds of things in, in the Valley.

And so let's start off, you are not an Arizona native. So let's start from the beginning. What brought you to Arizona?  

Sure. I'm from I'm from the New Orleans area and I came out here to go to Arizona State University. 

What a, what a smart man. What a smart man. I know.  And then what brought, okay, New Orleans, obviously one of the best musical capitals, you know, in the world.

So did you take some of that? What, what drew you to really getting involved in the, in the local music scene here when you came for ASU?  

Sure. So I, you know, growing up in that area in New Orleans, we used to go to concerts and clubs every weekend to go see the band. So obviously when I moved to. I did the same thing.

And that was kind of the era of long, longs and the gym blossoms and that at workshop and one and  

meat puppets, meat puppets, 

meat puppets. I wasn't cool enough to  hang out with the meat puppets in downtown Phoenix at that time. Cause I was like, you know, 17, 18 and I needed to get a job to get in state residency.

I think it was easier back then. And so I worked for I looked and I. Long story, but there was a job opening at ASU for a student concert director and it, you know, I applied for it and luckily got it and  was just hooked because I already loved going to see live music and then having a job in live music was was awesome.

It really hurt my grades because I just decided that,  that this is what I wanted to do and work way a lot more harder on that. You know, bringing in shows to ASU and working on shows that I did my school work, but, and 

Charlie, don't worry. Most, most sun devils have at least one thing in their undergrad that prevented them from properly.

So I'm grateful for you.  You provided me and so many others, so much joy. So you're promoting for ASU, doing the, doing the college campus thing where a lot of, a lot of good music promoters and owners Really stem from. So after that, did you get out into the kind of the Greater Phoenix region for more promotion? 

So I started to work for evening star, Danny Zelisko,  and I started off very part time. I started to buy talent and I realized it was not, I was not cut out to work  and lose money for somebody else. It just wasn't my cup of tea. Cause I felt really bad when I'd book a show and it would lose money and lose Danny's money.

So. Anyway, I went back to school, got my degree. And then after I got my degree, I realized I needed to start making money. And the one thing I knew how to do was book,  book shows. And I kind of fell backwards into a little bar called Nita's Hideaway, which is where the Tempe Marketplace is now. It was a little 200 seat room. 

And we asked Nita, who was a rodeo queen, if I could start having music there. And it was. One side was a junkyard with a junkyard dog, and the other side of it was a A adult bookstore and the behind it was it was where the carnies would hang out during the off season. And that was where, you know, I started to book bands there.

And a lot of bands played that little neat as hideaway club. 

When the movie is made out of your life, this is going to be a great scene. I can't wait to, I can't wait to see how this scene is played out. And you know, 

artists now have, you know, pretty nice backstage accommodate. I mean, if you go to the Van Buren, like, I could live in the backstage of the Van Buren.

And at the time when band would come, they were like, where's, where's our dressing room? Like, well, just go to the adult bookstore. There's a bathroom in there. Use that. 

So that's how it all, you know, that was it. And then at some point we ended up getting an Airstreamer, a used Airstreamer that didn't, you know, that had flat tires. And we got to, that was when we really stepped it up.  

That's incredible. What a good story. Now that was, it brings 

back memories of, of, of, of, you know, you know, and a lot of those bands were, you know, John Mayer played there and, you know, death camp for QT, I mean, you know, fans that.

Have gone on to be really successful.  I have to see them and be like, yeah, you know, they remember. 

We're going to save that for a few minutes. Cause I have a few of those things. Thanks to you. I've had, you know, front row to bands that were playing 300 person venues to two years later, headlining Coachella.

So, you know, always, always a good always a good thing to have. So you're, you're doing that now. You know, here at JPEC, obviously, you know, good development. Good community is hugely important. 2000 mid two thousands come great recession comes downtown Phoenix really takes a hit, you know, and, and I always say that there were really a couple of of, of key things that generated the redevelopment and kind of the vitality of downtown Phoenix, the music venues, which we're about to get into.

Cause you're behind a couple of them ASU really moving downtown and really, you know, Roosevelt row, just building that culture in that community. So explain how you got to the point. Cause Crescent ballroom is. That's kind of the crown jewel, in my opinion. You know, explain how you got to that point to opening Crescent Ballroom. 

So sure, so when NIDA's ended up going away because of the new marketplace, I started to be a, just a concert promoter. Like, you can start with rent out venues across the city.  And I realized that I need to have my own venue to really put, you know, my  thumbnail, my vision in place and, you know,  not renting out someone else's room.

So I was looking for a very, very long time. I was living down on basically Roosevelt and 4th  and I passed the Crescent building on a walk one day. I was like, this is great.  Very long story, but it was owned by this lovely lady named trip to Cabra as an investment and she had some sideways dealing with some of her tenants  and I called her up and she was living at the she moved from Phoenix and she was living in San Diego and I had a great advice from my old friend, Michelle Savoy.

And she said, fly out and meet her. Don't do it over the phone. So I flew out, we had a really big meal with her family. We talked for hours. We wrote down on a napkin, what can I afford to pay for the building? And on a napkin, she sold me the Crescent. 

So literal back of a napkin calculation.  

For real.

And I remember going to the, my attorney and like taking the napkins. I was like, you got to drop a contract like this. And he laid it on it, laid it on his desk. True story. And she was a lovely, she is a lovely lady. And she really took a chance on me. And was basically what, you know, what can you do to What can you afford?

And she worked with me. So thank you.  

That's fantastic. And obviously we'll do a quick plug for Crescent Ballroom, a good, incredible music venue, but also you got the cocina, you got great food. Chris 

Bianco for that. 

Chris, see, I knew Bianco is tied into this too. And let's just say, hypothetically, you're married to a vegan Crescent Ballroom is a great place to go because you can get vegan food and you can get non vegan food.

So just personally, I appreciate that. Thanks, 

Angela. Angela, my, and she's a part owner now and she is the vegan in the, in the, in the operation who makes sure we have good vegan food so she can eat. 

Vegans Valley wide are very grateful for for that, for those burritos and nachos. So, so that, so that opens up and I know that was right really when I had moved downtown and, and, you know, in, in really experiencing and enjoying that.

And we'll get to some of the shows, but then you obviously progressed. You kind of had a tiered system, if you will. So then a few years later. Valley bar, a more intimate and then Van Buren, the big boy kind of explain how you got into those because again, three very different venues of different sizes.

Sure. So present just, I knew that it would do decent with us bringing in national acts. That's where we've been doing. And it was such a great experience opening it up and such a fun team. And our offices were located at 130 North Central, which is the building Valley Bar is in. I was with the landlord one day and I go in the elevator.

Like, what's in the basement and he goes, oh, it's, you know, where, where my dad keeps a bunch of storage. I'm like, can you see it? It's like, sure. He has the key because you can go down there and I walked through it. It was just a bunch of.  Jump laid up like floor to ceiling  crap, basically,  and I looked at him, I go, can I rent this? 

That was it. I was like, you know, basement, this, this is a great place for a music venue.  And that was it. That was, I was like, let's do it. Let's do a venue. And at the time, I was noticing a trend where a lot of the bars, restaurants, venues were either I think a little bit taking too much.  Portland, Denver,  steel, brick,  like kind of Southern California, San Diego vibe.

And it was like, let's make an Arizona bar. Let's make it all about the valley, valley bar, Rose room, you know, color palettes of, you know, yellow for the sun.  All the drinks for Arizona politicians. We really, you know, if you really go in there, that when you use dread stories, really try to push that this is an Arizona, a Valley, a Phoenix, sorry.

I don't know why I keep saying Arizona. It's Phoenix. It's a Phoenix bar. The one who would do dread stories, Phoenix, you know? 

Yeah. I believe all the politicians, commerce, Congressman Gallego spoke for about two years straight about his drink at your bar. You know, that was like a key point for him.  

So, I mean, that was it.

We wanted a Phoenix bar. And so that was it. And, and it's, it's, you know, and then we had that level that was below, you know, Crescent more of a smaller club. And it's been great, you know, and it's, it's, I'm really proud of the design and how we, it's a Phoenix bar. Like, obviously it's called Valley Bar.

Yep. And I love it because it's a block away from the office. So anytime we want to cruise, cruise right up there, nice, intimate setting, but still getting some, I know I was looking up some of the concerts some of the venue concerts there over the last, and they were selling out so quick, you know, up and coming rappers and DJs and, you know, cool bands.

And so it's just it's been an incredible journey there, but now, you know, and then the last venue you've really been, you know, had a hand in was Van Buren, which I think. Almost every one of our listeners has heard about. Can you just give us a little backstory on how that got up and running? Cause that's a major, that's a major venue. 

The, the Pat Katelme and Jim Kirkendall bought the building and it's a couple of buildings around the block. And we met with them, great, great people to work with. And it was just a logical next step to to get into that, that 2000 seat club. I thought there was a big need for it. I was excited about it and, and like anything to make it world class venue for the artists and for the people that come and you know, that's basically it, they were great to work with.

They worked with us to make sure that, you know, it would be successful with the TIs and such and historic and.  And got my friend, you know, patching Clark to help with the design and away we went.  

And if you remember jeep and I've obviously, Oh, go ahead. No, I was going to say our 30th anniversary, you know, our Greater Phoenix is popping was held at Van Buren.

There was no, it was a no brainer. And it was one of our most successful events in our 30 year history. And the, you know, our, our, we had a thousand over a thousand people there and they absolutely loved it. It was such a blast.  

Super proud about that came out. Adapter reviews old, old Ford dealership, the Dudley, it's like the Dudley Dud dealership from like 1920 something.

It was really fun to to, to, to put that together. It was challenging to, you know, take that old building and make it a country venue, but I thought it came out.  Pretty good. 

It's a beautiful venue. Good food out front. I mean, again, I just everybody we talked to, you know, here in the valley and statewide, they absolutely love it.

And you know, it's just, I've seen I, I've put so much money into your venues. I, you know, I have spent a thank you.  But it's worth it because as we were saying, to go back to Crescent, you have such an eye for, I think that promotion booking side is so important, right? To these venues. And I always make the joke of, you know, run the jewels, a great hip hop duo of killer Mike and LP.

They come out with their first album in 14. They do a tour. They open at Crescent. I was there. There's about 250 of us. That was the great show. I was there.  Singing and rapping and sweating and having a blast. And then, you know, a year and a half later, they're headlining the Lost Lake festival after, and then it was Coachella.

So they go from, you know, and they were established rappers, but, you know, they go from filling 250 person venues to, you know, literally a hundred thousand people at, you know, these, these, these worldwide festivals. And and I, as, as, as much as I joke, that is a. A key memory for me is that that run the jewel show.

And I know so many music fans in the Valley have that story. As you were talking about death cab, John Mayer and your older venues, many, many folks have that here for, you know, Valley bar and Crescent. So I'm going to put you on the spot. I know. You can't it's like saying, you know, which one of your children do you love best?

But what is one of the shows not run the jewel since we just talked about it at any of your venues What's like the show that you are the most proud of? And or what was your favorite band that you booked that you got to see?  

Oh, man, you cannot I know I will not I will not I you know, it's always cool  When there's someone that played there and then, like you said,  headline Coachella and you're like, I cannot believe, you know, that 21 pilots played, you know, whoever it is Odessa played there.

Right. I can't believe that Tyler, you know, Childress played at, you know, at Valley bar, you know, Billy Joe Armstrong played at Valley bar. So I think that's really cool that those bands, you know, that's a fun experience. But as far as me. That's a tough one. I really liked you know, usually I'm like, I'm, I'm not really, you know, I'm not, I'm watching so much.

That's happening, but it's hard. I wish I could think of something right. Well, and 

I remember you telling me a story about Lizzo because remember she played the Van Buren after her Coachella set, and this was months after, and obviously it's sold out like immediately. And didn't you try to book her previously?

Was that, did you, do I, did I have that story? Right. I remember you trying to book Lizzo or I took it for on 

sale at Valley bar. They were, and we had to, unfortunately We had to, that show did not happen, but she almost played volleyball. 

But then at what a year later, it's selling out and now she's doing arena tours.

Yeah,  

that, what a, what a good, well we've had you for a few minutes here. I appreciate your time, Charlie. Again, I know you hate praise and I'm glad that this is on a podcast cause I can't see you squirm on screen on, but you have provided a And just in an, a great example of how to do it properly, how to support artists, how to support the community.

And again, I appreciate you taking some time to chat with us to really, you know, really show why in my humble opinion, and as a man who spent a lot of time near new Orleans, I was in the military. Phoenix has a great music scene and you are really, it really, 

it really does. And it's gotten better and better and better and more and more people are going to see live music.

And that makes me so happy. And obviously I'm the one on your podcast, but there's, you know, dozens and dozens, not hundreds of people that like put these venues together and work there every day. That really make it special. You know, I always, I always tell my whole staff that if I had half your, I'd be fired after a week.

If I worked in our kitchen, I couldn't, I couldn't handle what they do. So, I mean, a lot of kudos has to go to, you know, our teams. That that put it together and the artists that play there but  but the people of phoenix have just been such I could I the music scene has just grown and grown and grown and kudos to them 

Yep, and for all of our listeners we will post these links when we post the podcast But make sure you support these venues most importantly and the workers there and the artists At crescent ballroom at valley bar at van buren.

We'll post all those. Please take a look at the upcoming. Tours there is a lot of Of acts coming through and some really, really fun shows over the, over the, over the next few months and throughout the summer. So, again, with that, Charlie, I greatly appreciate you. Thank you for joining us. And thank you for providing some of this fun, colorful insight into your, your history here in the region.

So, with that, sir, we really appreciate it. 

No problem. Thanks, Tim.  

Once again, thank you to Michelle Donovan and Charlie Levy for joining us on the Greater Phoenix A to Z podcast. And thank you, the listener for tuning in. Do me and our guests a favor and be sure to subscribe to this podcast on your favorite podcast listening app.

And if you're so inclined, please rate us five stars and leave a comment. To keep up with what's happening in Greater Phoenix, please follow GPEC  @GreaterPHX on LinkedIn, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Twitter, and YouTube until next time be safe and well, cheers.